In pursuit of "purity"

In pursuit of "purity"

by SouthernFriedInfidel | Published on July 20th, 2008, 1:17 pm | Life

I don't know about you, but I find the idea of taking a four-year-old daughter to a party to pledge to "keep her pure" until she marries rather creepy. "Yes, daddy. I won't let any boys do... um WHAT?!" :roll:

It says that these events are increasingly being aimed at boys. Yeah... I bet that has a BIG impact. :twisted:

David Diefenderfer has slipped outside for a cigarette; he's a leathery South Dakotan in a big black cowboy hat, and he hands over his card. HAVE GUN, WILL TRAVEL: BREEDER SERVICE, it says, with a picture of a syringe. He's in the cattle-reproduction business. He's also the father of nine children by seven women. Three of his daughters are with him tonight, including 10-year-old Taylor. I asked what purity means to her. "I don't really know," she says, and she's shy about talking about all this. "But it means you make a promise to your dad to be a virgin until you are married and not have a lot of boyfriends."

not have a lot of boyfriends ... until you're married.

I agree. the whole chastity belt meme with the father handing over the key to her husband on her wedding is very creepy.

It basically says that girls can't be trusted to make good decisions for themselves and must always be under the protection of a man.

Both of you people are making ludicrous excuses for attacking virginity before marriage. Just because both of you guys didn't lose your virginity until age 30 (or more) is no good reason to assume that it's not a good practice for others.

Jan 29, 2008:

A Person wrote:I agree. the whole chastity belt meme with the father handing over the key to her husband on her wedding is very creepy.

It basically says that girls can't be trusted to make good decisions for themselves and must always be under the protection of a man.

Awww...Its not that bad.

And I believe it was a bracelet charm.

Women are fully capable of making their own decisions, probably more so than men. But women have a whole lot more to lose than men, and they know that. I don't blame the fathers for being protective, and as long as the girl agrees, there isn't a problem. But, yeah, kinda creepy. With those in-laws, I might rethink the marriage if I were the groom. :lol:

BecauseHeLives wrote:Both of you people are making ludicrous excuses for attacking virginity before marriage.

I personally had no choice on the matter of losing my virginity until I got married. When I did finally make that step, I wondered what the big deal was. I still see no reason to think less of any person on account of their choices regarding sexual activity. However, I am a big proponent of taking personal responsibility, using protection, and treating sex as a matter of caring intimacy... not as a matter of self-gratification.

BecauseHeLives wrote:Both of you people are making ludicrous excuses for attacking virginity before marriage.

Attacking virginity before marriage? I've never attacked a virgin nor suggested anyone should.

Nor would I encourage anyone to have sex (before or after marriage) unless they want to. It's a decision that is theirs alone and is no business of mine. My children are responsible people and fully capable of making their own decisions. I would no more think of telling them when to have sex, than when to go to the bathroom. My only advice to them was not to be pressured or forced into doing anything they did not want to do - which I think is 'general purpose' good advice for all.

BecauseHeLives wrote:because both of you guys didn't lose your virginity until age 30 (or more) is no good reason to assume that it's not a good practice for others.

From the smiley it would seem that this is a joke. BHL somehow thinks it's an insult to suggest that someone might not have sex until age 30. Since I got married at 28, that would be entirely in accordance with his 'morals'. So why does he think it funny?

But no BHL, divide that by two and you'd be correct. So what? That was my (and my partner's) decision and affected no one else. I don't think of it as something to boast about, neither do I regret it in any way. We used contraception and STD's were (obviously) not an issue. I really can't see what benefit 15 years of celibacy would have achieved for anyone.

A Person wrote:It's a decision that is theirs alone and is no business of mine. My children are responsible people and fully capable of making their own decisions. I would no more think of telling them when to have sex, than when to go to the bathroom. My only advice to them was not to be pressured or forced into doing anything they did not want to do - which I think is 'general purpose' good advice for all.

This is a good point, AP, and gets to the heart of the matter. You and I (and a lot of other parents) prefer to give our grown progeny advice, whereas the parents in this story prefer to give them orders.

Naturally, you give your kids orders when they are very young, but when they grow up enough that you can't watch their every move, one must be willing to give over (in sensible steps) that right of self-determination. I saw that need by recalling my own experience, and the way that my parents' desire to order me around even when I was 25 years old was counter-productive.

If you don't willingly give them what is due to them at their varying stages of maturation, they often will take it by force, and use it without any gained wisdom, because they weren't trained as they should have been.

Both myself and Shannon made the promise in Church. Mine was about 6th grade or so, and I believe Shan's was about the same. I know her sister made the same pact, but none of us followed through on our promises.

With my children ages away, and without seeming to hypocritical.... I will state clearly they won't have sex till they're 30....

A Person wrote: I really can't see what benefit 15 years of celibacy would have achieved for anyone.

dern... you both missed out. You each could have had a loooovely purity promise ring!

: purity.jpg (6.7 KiB) Viewed 370 times

Actually she does (did.)

I got a free bible.

Hm. 15 years of onanism and a ring. Yeah, that's a LOT better! Dang! :twisted:

I could have had a ring if I'd wanted one.

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Hey be glad that's all these parents do. Some religious families go to much farther lengths to ensure their children are Godly.

A Person wrote:I agree. the whole chastity belt meme with the father handing over the key to her husband on her wedding is very creepy.

It basically says that girls can't be trusted to make good decisions for themselves and must always be under the protection of a man.

Agree. And it's b.s.

I would say more, but I am laughing too much at "purity balls"

ballz

:lol:

Do any of you people see a problem with encouraging your children to maintain their virginity until marriage? What a warped society we live in when virginity is looked down upon.

I say skip the nonsense and go straight to titanium chastity belts with GPS and Internet controlled parental tasering system built in.

BecauseHeLives wrote:Do any of you people see a problem with encouraging your children to maintain their virginity until marriage? What a warped society we live in when virginity is looked down upon.

It's not that we "look down on" virginity -- rather, it's that we see no value to it per se. Sex is a biological function that we have naturally. Well, most of us, at least. I taught my son the importance of being careful and respectful of others' views on the subject -- especially those of his girl friend. But I saw no reason to try and instill some sort of fear or hatred of sex that would magically be removed once he participated in a social ceremony.

It's not that we "look down on" virginity -- rather, it's that we see no value to it per se.

That outlook is a direct result of having no moral compass to go by. There is a lot of value to virginity and I'd gamble that your own wife disagrees with you.

Sex is a biological function that we have naturally.

Sex is a biological function. Not virginity. Virginity is a gift and it's also described in the bible as a great gift. Virginity is the greatest gift you can give to your new spouse.

I taught my son the importance of being careful and respectful of others' views on the subject -- especially those of his girl friend.

Sorry. You only taught your son moral relativity. Not right from wrong. It's fine to be respectful of other peoples decisions but teaching your son "Yeah, its ok to go have sex as longs as she is ok with it and you have safe sex" is just a bunch of baloney.

But I saw no reason to try and instill some sort of fear or hatred of sex that would magically be removed once he participated in a social ceremony.

I don't know of anyone that DOES teach that. If they are maintaining virginity for those reasons then those are the wrong reasons.

BecauseHeLives wrote:Virginity is a gift and it's also described in the bible as a great gift.

You want to use the Bible as a guide for sex? And you talk of moral relativism!

BecauseHeLives wrote:
It's not that we "look down on" virginity -- rather, it's that we see no value to it per se.

That outlook is a direct result of having no moral compass to go by.

I have a "moral compass," but it doesn't always point the same way yours does. We've long mentioned the way common morality changes over time. The area of sexual mores is an are of wide variety across all societies, even across Christian ones. It makes for interesting study... if you're not too emotional about the subject.

There is a lot of value to virginity...

Really? What might that be, pray tell?

Sorry. You only taught your son moral relativity. Not right from wrong.

Perhaps you will one day have the opportunity to meet up with him personally and discuss this subject with him. I think that would be a very interesting afternoon.

BecauseHeLives wrote:That outlook is a direct result of having no moral compass to go by. There is a lot of value to virginity and I'd gamble that your own wife disagrees with you.

...

Sex is a biological function. Not virginity. Virginity is a gift and it's also described in the bible as a great gift. Virginity is the greatest gift you can give to your new spouse.

Yeah, yeah... tell that to a fourteen year old who lost her virginity when she was raped. See what that does to her... see how that helps her with the healing process.

SouthernFriedInfidel wrote:
BecauseHeLives wrote:
It's not that we "look down on" virginity -- rather, it's that we see no value to it per se.

That outlook is a direct result of having no moral compass to go by.

I have a "moral compass," but it doesn't always point the same way yours does. We've long mentioned the way common morality changes over time. The area of sexual mores is an are of wide variety across all societies, even across Christian ones. It makes for interesting study... if you're not too emotional about the subject.
There is a lot of value to virginity...

Really? What might that be, pray tell?
Sorry. You only taught your son moral relativity. Not right from wrong.

Perhaps you will one day have the opportunity to meet up with him personally and discuss this subject with him. I think that would be a very interesting afternoon.

I notice you didn't comment on the following:

I'd gamble that your own wife disagrees with you.

You say you have a moral compass but it is completely relative. It may point one way one time and another way the next day. What is right and wrong for somebody else may not be right or wrong for you. It's like sitting on the North pole and trying to point East or West.

As far as the value of virginity goes: I could go into the biological and emotional consequences of pre-marital sex but I won't because I'm sure you and everyone else here is already fully aware of them. By maintaining virginity you not only avoid many of those pitfalls but you develop strong principles, discipline and you don't let your sex drive make important decisions in your life. Besides all of that, and not the least by any means, is that you will be blessed by God and you will also be a blessing to your mate.

BHL's moral compass:

: moralcompass.jpg (18.09 KiB) Viewed 280 times

Always points where he's facing.

Serendipitous wrote:
BecauseHeLives wrote:That outlook is a direct result of having no moral compass to go by. There is a lot of value to virginity and I'd gamble that your own wife disagrees with you.

...

Sex is a biological function. Not virginity. Virginity is a gift and it's also described in the bible as a great gift. Virginity is the greatest gift you can give to your new spouse.

Yeah, yeah... tell that to a fourteen year old who lost her virginity when she was raped. See what that does to her... see how that helps her with the healing process.

Rape is a traumatic event that takes a physical and emotional toll on a person. It's even moreso when the victim is a virgin. The gift was stolen from her. Discussing the benfits of virginity will not help the healing of the victim. Why would you even mention it??

BecauseHeLives wrote:
Rape is a traumatic event that takes a physical and emotional toll on a person. It's even moreso when the victim is a virgin. The gift was stolen from her. Discussing the benfits of virginity will not help the healing of the victim. Why would you even mention it??

Hello? You just mentioned it. In your thinking, you would have mentioned it to your daughter long ago. It would be ingrained in their head already adding to the mindfark.

You know this archaic way of thinking does nothing but continue the cycle that objectifies women. If the "gift" is virginity (thus objectified) and it's so wonderful, does it become 'damaged goods' after the rape?

You really can't see where this is faulty thinking can you?