You don't get to complain about gas prices if...

by **Liv** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:43 pm

I was woken up this morning at 5 AM by a early 90's Lincoln Town Car with no muffler idyling outside my window this morning. It sat there for 30 minutes, in what I can only assume was to keep the car warm while waiting for its passenger. That's when I thought, "YOU IDIOT! Don't dare, ever, complain about gas prices, while you waste fuel so candidly!"- of course, they're bound to be the first to complain about gas prices, and how Romney, would fix them in instant. What tossers!

So before I fell back to sleep, I thought of a list of other reasons that....

I'm certain there's more, but this is the current list of pet-peeves I created in the early morning hours listening to the Town Car idle outside my window.

by **SouthernFriedInfidel** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:59 pm

And don't forget that you contributed to high fuel prices if you voted for the people who have decided not to regulate the bastards that are most responsible for price raises: oil futures speculators.

by **Liv** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 4:00 pm

I like the bumper sticker: SUVs fund Terrorism.

by **Jamy** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:39 pm

Liv wrote:I like the bumper sticker: SUVs fund Terrorism.

Oh hell yes! I like that too! I'd make one for my car except it's a mini-van and I don't feel like I'm in any position to throw stones.

by **A Person** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 4:43 pm

22-You've never bought gas in another country and hence don't realize that the US has the cheapest gas in the developed world

by **SouthernFriedInfidel** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:45 pm

Since we recently became a net exporter of hydrocarbon energy, shouldn't we join OPEC and start paying the same prices they have in THOSE countries?

by **Liv** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:45 pm

A Person wrote:22-You've never bought gas in another country and hence don't realize that the US has the cheapest gas in the developed world

Added.

by **Liv** » Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:48 pm

SouthernFriedInfidel wrote:Since we recently became a net exporter of hydrocarbon energy, shouldn't we join OPEC and start paying the same prices they have in THOSE countries?

This country would shut down if we paid per liter what we pay per gallon. I consider my Taurus somewhat fuel efficient, though we never drive it any more, at 25 MPG... but it was costing me $600+ a month to commute to school while driving that, now it costs me about $300, but I know a lot of people who own 15 MPG vehicles. That's like $800 a month in gas. If we tripled that overnight, that's $2400 a month in gas.

As I see it, most of America would demand a nuclear attack on even Britain if it got to that point.

by **A Person** » Tue Mar 13, 2012 4:26 pm

Liv wrote: I consider my Taurus somewhat fuel efficient, though we never drive it any more, at 25 MPG... but it was costing me $600+ a month to commute to school while driving that, now it costs me about $300, but I know a lot of people who own 15 MPG vehicles. That's like $800 a month in gas. If we tripled that overnight, that's $2400 a month in gas

Assuming $4 per gallon, that $600 equates to driving some 3,600 miles per month. 43,000 per year. If you're doing that 'commuting to school' your school must be 90 miles away. Have you considered moving closer?

I don't spend $300 a month on gas and I have an unusually long commute

by **Liv** » Tue Mar 13, 2012 7:07 pm

Our round trip circuit is about 100 miles.

We drive from da hood 12 miles each morning taking the kids to school, then from there we drive 45 miles to our school(s), then return back. On days I have extra-curricular activities, that trip is doubled.

I'd love to move close... I'd love to live on campus. I even made an attempt to pursue such a goal, but I didn't get reciprocal support from the other half of my partnership.

The biggest issue is the kids school. It's nice, and we like it... and getting into another one nearer to school is difficult. I've been advised public school is not an option. (I can't afford private.)

The nice thing is we do have a tiny rent, $450ish. It's a nice, safe place (important for kids) to live within walking distance to a lot of stuff. My landlord is my parents, and of course, I would have to consider the burden on them if we got up and left.

That said, our plan, and it's only a plan at this point... which can change, fail, etc... is to leave in approx. two years any ways.
But that will hopefully be abroad.

by **SouthernFriedInfidel** » Tue Mar 13, 2012 9:59 pm

One disadvantage to driving a proper commuter car is that no longer driving 70 miles a day, as I have over the past year, is that the savings on gas isn't all that helpful to the budget. What's left of it...

by **Liv** » Tue Mar 13, 2012 11:43 pm

But it's probably paid for itself over a few times by now.

Mine should pay for itself by the end of the semester just in gas.

To me it's also insurance against further gas hikes.

I can replace the entire motor for $1600, I have a rust-free body, it's seats 4 and has a/c...

The only thing I wish it had was a giant sunroof.

by **A Person** » Sat Mar 17, 2012 4:03 pm

You do know you can get aftermarket glass roofs that are quite easy to install - once you are prepared to cut into the steel roof of your car (you could use glass shelves from Ikea, but that's another post)

A chart from The Economist shows why the US is so vulnerable to oil price fluctuations. It's because gas is so cheap. Since taxes make up so little of the pump price there's no buffer. The higher taxes in other countries act to moderate the effect of the production cost of the gas

Petrol prices in America are substantially below levels elsewhere in the rich world, and this is almost entirely due to the rock bottom level of petrol tax rates. The low cost of petrol encourages greater dependence; the average American uses much more oil per day than other rich world citizens. This dependence also impacts infrastructure investment choices, leading to substantially more spending on highways than transit alternatives. And this, in turn, reduces the ability of American households to substitute away from driving when oil prices rise.

There are any number of good reasons to raise the petrol tax rate. The current rate no longer brings in enough money to cover current highway spending. Petrol taxes are an efficient way to raise revenue, and the government needs revenue; President Obama's deficit commission recommended an increase in the federal petrol tax rate. Burning oil produces carbon emissions, and dearer fuel would reduce America's sky-high per capita carbon footprint. But a higher tax rate would also diminish the possibility that a sudden rise in oil prices would throw the economy into recession. That would be a nice risk to minimise! And yes, higher tax rates would hit consumers just like rising oil prices. But those prices are rising anyway; better to capture the revenue and use it, all while improving behaviour.

by **Liv** » Sat Mar 17, 2012 6:38 pm

A Person wrote:You do know you can get aftermarket glass roofs that are quite easy to install - once you are prepared to cut into the steel roof of your car (you could use glass shelves from Ikea, but that's another post)

No I found a sunroof on Ebay for about $250, but the idea of cutting my roof puts the fear of God in me.

I'm okay with numbers, and tools.... but this one, I'd much rather defer to someone more mathematically capable.

Perhaps, I'd do fine... but it's not like there's a second try.

There's a place in town that does sunroofs, though it looks like higher end stuff... I've thought about driving by there, but I keep telling myself it would probably leak any ways, and that- that is a lot of money just to feel free and alive on my commute.

by **Liv** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 12:44 am

5000 miles on a tank of gas.

by **Jamy** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:16 pm

I'm sorry, but the price on that thing is ridiculous. Why tout savings when the thing costs as much as a friggin' cadillac? The reason they didn't meet their 10,000 sold goal is because not a lot of people can afford the damned things. Talk about setting yourself up for failure.

I'd love to own a hybrid...hell, I'd be happy with a plain old Honda, but not for $35k My van didn't even cost that.

by **A Person** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:31 pm

And that neatly sums up the problem with low gas prices in the US. They encourage dependance on gas.

$35,000 for a car is not particularly high, and even with the low gas prices in the US it would save you $5-10,000 per year. If the US had European gas prices it would pay for itself in two years.

by **Liv** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 2:43 pm

People bought the Prius like Happy Meals, and aren't those about $35000?

I think GM has the right idea with this car. I've been thinking it for years. A completely electric car with a small gas motor for recharging.

Of course I think with the return of the 3 cylinder next year, you're going to see hybrids fall out of favor.

Both GM and Ford are apparently bringing them back.

I love my little Metro's 3 cylinder. Absolutely my most favorite car ever.

by **Jamy** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 3:20 pm

US gas prices may be low, but NC has some of the lowest paying wages too. The average schmo in this state can't afford a 30K car. We could never afford this car new and we're actually pretty darned frugal with our money. I don't know a lot of people who could. And while I can totally see how such a car would eventually pay for itself and am completely behind it's environmentally friendliness, you don't have to apply for a loan to get your gas either. Of course, there's always the option to buy a used car, but if not enough people are buying them new, then there won't be any for anyone to buy used either.

by **A Person** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 3:59 pm

Depending on the mileage you do, the gas savings would approach the loan cost ...

Assuming:
$5000 down payment/trade in
$5000 incentives
$30,000 to finance
5% interest
60 month schedule
= $600/month

by **Liv** » Tue Mar 20, 2012 10:46 pm

...or buy a Geo Metro:

Metro = $1400
Brakes = $400
Minor repairs = $200
____________________
Total = $2000.

Getting 450 Miles+ per tank and paying $35 fill it up = priceless.

I should have my car paid off in GAS by the end of the semester, and then it's just money in the bank....

by **Jamy** » Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:51 am

Liv wrote:...or buy a Geo Metro:

Metro = $1400
Brakes = $400
Minor repairs = $200
____________________
Total = $2000.

Getting 450 Miles+ per tank and paying $35 fill it up = priceless.

I should have my car paid off in GAS by the end of the semester, and then it's just money in the bank....

Yeah, think that's the route I'd go.

by **Liv** » Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:14 am

They're getting hard to find, the three cyl, five speeds. Especially rust free ones. I complained when I bought mine, because there was a lot wrong with it initially, and mostly because the a-hole lied, but now knowing how hard it is to find a rust free one, especially from Florida, especially with A/C... I think I did very well on the deal.

If you see a rust-free five speed, three cylinder one ever for sale, I'd highly recommend buying one... they're an investment opportunity as this point. If you ever find one labeled XFI, it's like gold... they get nearly 60 MPG stock.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/LIVING/wayoflif ... pstoryview

I'm looking for a convertible model as we speak to dump my Taurus for good.

by **Jamy** » Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:32 am

Hondas get amazing mileage. That's the only kind of car I used to own and this really old 70s model I used to have got like 40 miles to the gallon. I love Hondas.

by **Liv** » Wed Mar 21, 2012 12:26 pm

I owned a 82 Prelude, and a 95 Civic... and both were great cars. It appears though today, unless you buy it new, you're likely to end up with one that a teenager has turned into "2 Fast 2 Furious".

I think it's the Civic VX, that's super high efficient, but finding one would be near impossible.

But honestly, I don't say this lightly, I think The Metro is my favorite car I've ever owned. I've owned leather seats, high-horse-power, but the simplicity and ease of what this car does is amazing. The idea that a few bolts and a couple strong guys can literally remove the engine or transmission in a few minutes boggles my mind, and then there's the gas mileage, which is insane.
They're roomy (bigger on the inside) and have fairly decent pick-up. (Likely not sufficient for the average American though.)

I wish I would have bought one of these a couple cars ago. My family could have afforded to go a lot more places and do a lot more things if we would have.