Atheist bus campaign offends in Britain

Atheist bus campaign offends in Britain

by SouthernFriedInfidel | Published on January 9th, 2009, 5:00 pm | Religion

As with the "Imagine no religion" offensiveness in California, the very fact that some atheist group might speak out in public in Britain is drawing complaints.

What I want to know is -- why? With all the advertising that Jesus gets, is there really a reason to complain when someone says -- without using "strong language" yet! -- otherwise? Are these people so fragile in their faith that they can't bear the thought of even seeing the existence of other points of view?

Pathetic.

What is really interesting is that the Christians are asking the Advertising Standards Association to rule on whether God is likely or not. An issue that has occupied theist philosophers for millennia. I wonder if they are prepared to accept the consequences.

Let's not forget that the adverts were a direct response to these Christian ads

that linked to this site:
http://www.jesussaid.org/

Jesussaid.org wrote:What are the consequences if you reject the answer?
God’s wrath includes the prospect of eternal punishment – it is appointed to men to die once and then comes the judgment (Hebrews 9:27). You will rise from the dead and will face the Judge and know that you rejected His kind and merciful answer. You will be condemned to everlasting separation from God and then you spend all eternity in torment in hell. Jesus spoke about this as a lake of fire which was prepared for the devil and all his angels (demonic spirits) (Matthew 25: 41

. I'd like to see them substantiate the truthfulness of that!

The reality is that the Advertising Standards Agency will simply respond to Stephen Green as they did to Ariane Sherine by saying "there's nothing in the advertising standards code to prohibit advertising a religious message."

Have I ever mentioned how much I love Britain????

The reasons just keep mounting...

I think its hilarious that they used the word "probably" in the slogan. They sound pretty sure don't they? :lol:

BecauseHeLives wrote:I think its hilarious that they used the word "probably" in the slogan. They sound pretty sure don't they?

Tone, BHL...

People would dismiss it too easily, if it didn't come across as humble.

Liv wrote:
BecauseHeLives wrote:I think its hilarious that they used the word "probably" in the slogan. They sound pretty sure don't they?

Tone, BHL...

People would dismiss it too easily, if it didn't come across as humble.

Yeah, humble militant atheists are attractive, eh? :think:

BecauseHeLives wrote:
Liv wrote:
BecauseHeLives wrote:I think its hilarious that they used the word "probably" in the slogan. They sound pretty sure don't they?

Tone, BHL...

People would dismiss it too easily, if it didn't come across as humble.

Yeah, humble militant atheists are attractive, eh?

When it is not in our power to follow what is true, we ought to follow what is most probable. –Rene Descartes

[quote="Serendipitous"When it is not in our power to follow what is true, we ought to follow what is most probable. –Rene Descartes[/quote]

Welcome to the faith S!

It's not a sop to humilty, it is the supportable position that most atheists take. We are all Teapot Agnostics. I would have preferred 'almost certainly' but it means the same.

A Person wrote:It's not a sop to humilty, it is the supportable position that most atheists take. We are all Teapot Agnostics. I would have preferred 'almost certainly' but it means the same.

Everyone should feel free to assign the probability value they think makes most sense. My view is that the terms "atheist" and "agnostic" are non-overlapping, and so I consider myself to be both. I, like AP, expect that the probability of God's existence is pretty bloody low indeed, so I stopped bothering myself about it years ago. I think my life has become generally much happier since then. Which is the point of the ads.

Ariane Sherine wrote:Lots of you have asked why the word "probably" is included in the ad slogan, and stated that you'd prefer the wording to read "There's no God". While I fully understand this view, there's a vital reason for the "probably"'s inclusion: as with the Carlsberg ads, it's likely to get us around the advertising regulations (specifically points 3.1, 3.2, 5.1, 8.1, 9.1 and 11.1 in the general rules of the CAP Code, which regulates non-broadcast adverts in the UK). In my view, neither version of the slogan breaches the code, but CAP has advised that "the inclusion of the word 'probably' makes it less likely to cause offence, and therefore be in breach of the Advertising Code."

There's another reason I'm keen on the "probably": it means the slogan is more accurate, as even though there's no scientific evidence at all for God's existence, it's also impossible to prove that God doesn't exist (or that anything doesn't). As Richard Dawkins states in The God Delusion, saying "there's no God" is taking a "faith" position. He writes: "Atheists do not have faith; and reason alone could not propel one to total conviction that anything definitely does not exist". His choice of words in the book is "almost certainly"; but while this is closer to what most atheists believe, "probably" is shorter and catchier, which is helpful for advertising. I also think the word is more lighthearted, and somehow makes the message more positive.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... ne-sherine

I've been reviewing the CAP code and the atheist bus ad may well have a case to answer. Under the 'truthfulness' provisions, the Code says, "No marketing communication should mislead, or be likely to mislead, by inaccuracy, ambiguity, exaggeration, omission or otherwise." Under the section dealing with "substantiation", the Code says, "If there is a significant division of informed opinion about any claims made in a marketing communication they should not be portrayed as generally agreed." Similarly, under the "matters of opinion" provisions, the Code says, "Marketers may give a view about any matter, including the qualities or desirability of their products, provided it is clear that they are expressing their own opinion rather than stating a fact."

If the Atheist Bus ad read "Humanists believe God probably doesn't exist ..." or even (to lose the word "probably") "Humanists say God doesn't exist", these statements would appear to be meet the requirements of the ASA Code because a matter of opinion is clearly noted as such. VIA

Apparently they're saying since popular opinion states God exists, they can't say he doesn't.

Liv wrote:Apparently they're saying since popular opinion states God exists, they can't say he doesn't.

I think it's also a matter of trying to cover the secular humanist community as well as possible. There are many who would say "I know there's no God," while others prefer the more literal "I have no beliefs in any gods." Using the word "probably" would be acceptable to both major sectors of that population. I think... :dance:

Compare their outrage with their acceptance of the bus ads placed by jesussaid.org, e.g. Jesus Said: For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Firstly Jesus didn't say that, Paul is credited as the author. Secondly let's see them prove, not that this is 'probable' but is actual fact, according to the ASA standards.

I do find it amazing how such an innocuous statement as 'There's probably no God' is being reported around the world - as an example of militant New Atheism!

In retrospect the mildness of the assertion is probably a good thing. It achieved the same outrage as a stronger statement but the repsonse is so much more out of proportion that the result is actually more effective.

January 14th, 2009, 1:13 pm Reply with quote

Bus Driver 'shocked and horrified'

Mr Heather told BBC Radio Solent: "I was just about to board and there it was staring me in the face, my first reaction was shock horror.

"I felt that I could not drive that bus, I told my managers and they said they haven't got another one and I thought I better go home, so I did.

How shockingly horrifying. What better encouragement to make sure the adverts are on every bus.

I wonder if he would object to this one?

"Oh no, I need a week in bed to recover"

Jesus Christ... first the bloody tube, now the busses.... Good thing Christians over here drive fancy SUVs and the poor people ride public transportation.

Despite 326 complaints the ASA have ruled that the bus adverts do not breach the advertising code. 326 complaints? Some people have very thin skins.

The ASA wrote:"The Advertising Standards Authority has concluded that the 'There's probably no God' bus ad campaign by the British Humanist Association is not in breach of the advertising code. The ASA will therefore not launch an investigation and the case is now closed.

"The ASA carefully assessed the 326 complaints it received. Some complained that the ad was offensive and denigratory to people of faith. Others challenged whether the ad was misleading because the advertiser would not be able to substantiate its claim that God 'probably' does not exist.

"The ASA Council concluded that the ad was an expression of the advertiser's opinion and that the claims in it were not capable of objective substantiation.

"Although the ASA acknowledges that the content of the ad would be at odds with the beliefs of many, it concluded that it was unlikely to mislead or to cause serious or widespread offence."

I can only imagine the churches will counter with something very offensive now.

Liv wrote:I can only imagine the churches will counter with something very offensive now.

In Britain? Highly unlikely. The churches know better (generally) than to do anything that might thin out their already nearly non-existent crowds.

Britain has some fundamentalist churches - there has been a strong push from US evangelical fundamentalists into other countries. And just as many US churches have fatwah envy, many British ones covet the popularity and financial success of the US ones.

I fully expect Jesussaid.org to retaliate with another ad program. Should be interesting to see if they decide to follow the same standards

http://ruletheweb.co.uk/b3ta/bus/ February 6th, 2009, 9:32 am Reply with quote

http://ruletheweb.co.uk/b3ta/bus/

A Person wrote:I fully expect Jesussaid.org to retaliate with another ad program. Should be interesting to see if they decide to follow the same standards

Here is the remarkably original response

That really is quite funny - given the nature of the complaint to the ASA. I wonder if they are willing to live by the same standards.

I don't expect the ASA to ban the ads - nor should they - but the irony will not be lost on most people

I used to follow up on claims for definite proof of God's existence. When I finally figured out that all of them boiled down to "because we say so," I stopped bothering myself. Might as well ask for evidence for leprechauns or the friggin' Tooth Fairy.

February 13th, 2009, 11:49 am Reply with quote