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Terror attack averted in Detroit

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Published on December 26th, 2009, 7:51 am
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It appears that Al Qaeda is still working on their goal of terrorizing America at all costs. Oddly, this attack that was attempted yesterday only had one fellow who got through security. This story doesn't mention the question of whether multiple attacks might have been attempted (as is Al Qaeda's wont), which I find interesting. Another failure of the media to ask the questions that ordinary people want answered...

Of course, there are a lot more questions to be discussed in the coming months. Like how are they going to upgrade security screenings as a result of this? This sap carried his explosives apparently packed around his junk. Will airport screenings become more intrusive as a result? NOT looking forward to getting that question answered...

And I think it's going to be interesting to see how this putz adds to the knowledge of the intelligence community about Al Qaeda operations. He started his flight to Detroit in Nigeria. This of course leads to the question of just how can we say that the wars we have on our hands are really being effective against terrorism? Well, that is certainly not a new question. I've been wondering that ever since 2003, when America failed to capture Bin Laden and started a war of personal convenience in Iraq.

The whole thing needs to be re-thought. And I hope there are people in Washington who are courageous enough to state that fact to the right people.
December 26th, 2009, 7:51 am   Share
 
Wait till they start smuggling stuff in their orifices....
This is our chance to change things, this is our destiny.
December 26th, 2009, 1:07 pm
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Liv
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It's really a war of ideals.

You change their minds, you change their hearts you win the war.

Something I am really curious about is brainwashing, propaganda v.s freewill.

Brainwashing does not robs someone of freewill. But it provides misinformation...

The thing is these terrorist believe they are doing the "right" thing.
December 26th, 2009, 2:13 pm
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ecofox
 
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ecofox wrote:It's really a war of ideals.

You change their minds, you change their hearts you win the war.

Something I am really curious about is brainwashing, propaganda v.s freewill.

Brainwashing does not robs someone of freewill. But it provides misinformation...

The thing is these terrorist believe they are doing the "right" thing.


Yes it's called religion. They know 'Absolute Truth' and act on it. They trust the "Word of God" and follow God's instructions to the letter.

Changing the mind of a religious zealot, convinced he has a direct line to God, isn't easy since they are not amenable to reason. If you try, they respond with long rants of scripture, screeds of misinformation and propaganda, all the while complaining about how persecuted they are.
On Vacation
December 26th, 2009, 5:25 pm
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Large amounts of money sometimes work.
December 26th, 2009, 5:35 pm
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Liv
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A Person wrote:Yes it's called religion.


Religion
4 : a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith


You believe in something, you are religious.

A Person wrote:They know 'Absolute Truth' and act on it. They trust the "Word of God" and follow God's instructions to the letter.


The Qu'ran does not fit the criteria of Absolute Truth.

http://www.islamicity.com/Mosque/99names.htm

Eternal
Allah claims to be eternal
Sura [3:2] GOD: there is no god except He; the Living, the Eternal.

Unchanging (Law of Non-contradiction)
Allah never claims to be unchanging.

Never contradicts itself.
Allah claims to be deceitful.
Sura [3:54] They plotted and schemed, but so did GOD, and GOD is the best schemer.

Sura [3:3] He sent down to you this scripture, truthfully, confirming all previous scriptures, and He sent down the Torah and the Gospel

Allah sent the Torah and the Gospel? Huh?

http://www.submission.org/suras/sura3.htm

Conclusion:
Allah is not Absolute Truth
Just another mutilation of it.

Correction wrote:Changing the mind of a religious zealot, convinced he is a god, isn't easy since they are not amenable to reason. If you try, they respond with long rants of illogical evolutionary bias, screeds of misinformation and propaganda, all the while complaining about how persecuted they are.


The sword cuts both ways.

Allah teaches blood shed.
Sura 9:5 Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them, and take them (captive), and besiege them, and prepare for them each ambush.

http://www.truthtube.tv/play.php?vid=2008
Last edited by ecofox on December 26th, 2009, 8:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
December 26th, 2009, 6:25 pm
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ecofox wrote:Religion
4 : a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith


You believe in something, you are religious.
No. Enthusiasm for physical evidence and reasoned logic is the antithesis of faith and religion.

ecofox wrote:Allah claims to be eternal
Sura [3:2] GOD: there is no god except He; the Living, the Eternal.

Unchanging (Law of Non-contradiction)
Allah never claims to be unchanging.

Never contradicts itself.
Allah claims to be deceitful.
Sura [3:54] They plotted and schemed, but so did GOD, and GOD is the best schemer.

Sura [3:3] He sent down to you this scripture, truthfully, confirming all previous scriptures, and He sent down the Torah and the Gospel

Allah sent the Torah and the Gospel? Huh?

Yahweh claims to be deceitful...
1 Kings 22:23
Now, therefore, behold, the Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of these thy prophets, and the Lord hath spoken evil concerning thee.

2 Chronicles 18:22
Now therefore, behold, the Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of these thy prophets.

Jeremiah 4:10
Ah, Lord GOD! surely thou hast greatly deceived this people.

Jeremiah 20:7
O Lord, thou hast deceived me, and I was deceived.

Ezekiel 14:9
And if a prophet be deceived when he hath spoken a thing, I the Lord have deceived that prophet.

2 Thessalonians 2:11
For this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie.

Yahweh changes His mind

Genesis 6:6
And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.

Exodus 32:14
And the Lord repented of the evil which he thought to do unto his people.

Deuteronomy 32:36
For the Lord shall judge his people, and repent himself for his servants.

1 Samuel 15:11
It repenteth me [God] that I have set up Saul to be king.

1 Samuel 15:35
The Lord repented that he had made Saul king over Israel.

2 Samuel 24:16
The Lord repented of the evil, and said to the angel that destroyed the people, it is enough: stay now thine hand.

1 Chronicles 21:15
The Lord beheld, and he repented him of the evil, and said to the angel that destroyed, It is enough, stay now thine hand.

Isaiah 38:1-5
In those days was Hezekiah sick unto death. And Isaiah ... said unto him, Thus saith the LORD, Set thine house in order: for thou shalt die, and not live. ... Thus saith the LORD ... I have heard thy prayer, I have seen thy tears: behold, I will add unto thy days fifteen years.

Jeremiah 15:6
I [God] am weary of repenting.

Jeremaih 18:8
I [God] will repent of the evil that I thought to do unto them.

Jeremaih 26:3
That I [God]may repent me of the evil, which I purpose to do unto them.

Jeremiah 26:13
The Lord will repent him of the evil that he hath pronounced against you.

Jeremiah 26:19
The Lord repented him of the evil which he had pronounced against them.

Jeremaih 42:10
For I [God] repent me of the evil that I have done unto you.

Amos 7:3, 6
The Lord repented for this.

Jonah 3:10
God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them.

ecofox wrote:The sword cuts both ways.

Allah teaches blood shed.

Yahweh teaches bloodshed:

Deuteronomy 13:6-10
If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you, nigh unto thee, or far off from thee, from the one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth; Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him: But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people. And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die.

2 Chronicles 15:13
Whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman.


ecofox wrote:Conclusion:
Allah is not Absolute Truth
Just another mutilation of it.

Conclusion:
Yahweh is not Absolute Truth
Just another god invented by man
December 26th, 2009, 7:40 pm
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A Person wrote:
ecofox wrote:Religion
4 : a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith

You believe in something, you are religious.


No. Enthusiasm for physical evidence and reasoned logic is the antithesis of faith and religion.


Where did you get that definition from? Why don't you check out the dictionary?

In the contrary my friend. Enthusiasm for physical evidence and reasoned logic led me to believe in God.

It's rather hard for me to swallow the theory that the universe erupted from nothing for no reason at all.
From Nothing we arise to nothing we return is that not the atheistic way?

Rather I seek Truth. While many may deny it.

Tell me, you cite lot's of scripture. You have asked, What is Truth?

Are you ready to let go of all bias, and misconceptions to seek Truth with all of you heart?

Jeremiah 29:11-13
11 For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, saith the LORD, thoughts of peace, and not of evil, to give you an expected end. 12 Then shall ye call upon me, and ye shall go and pray unto me, and I will hearken unto you. 13 And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart.

Are you truly ready to seek Truth?
December 26th, 2009, 9:47 pm
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ecofox wrote:Where did you get that definition from? Why don't you check out the dictionary?


That was your definition, I don't know where you got it from. Even then you had to ignore the earlier three senses of the word which undoubtedly said something like

1. Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe.
- A personal or institutionalized system grounded in such belief and worship.
2. The life or condition of a person in a religious order.
3. A set of beliefs, values, and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader.

and select the fourth meaning which refers to someone with religious like 'ardor and faith'

ecofox wrote:In the contrary my friend. Enthusiasm for physical evidence and reasoned logic led me to believe in God.

It's rather hard for me to swallow the theory that the universe erupted from nothing for no reason at all.
From Nothing we arise to nothing we return is that not the atheistic way?

No, your knowledge of cosmology is as deficient as your knowledge of evolution, science in general and slightly worse than your knowledge of comparative religions.

It is the religious that believe that the universe was created in a puff of magic words for some ineffable reason, that Man was created by rolling a ball of mud and breathing on it, and Woman from a spare rib. All in 6 24-hour days a few thousand years ago. I'm sure that examination of the physical evidence and reason led you to that conclusion. Not forgetting the talking snake of course.

ecofox wrote:Tell me, you cite lot's of scripture.
To specifically refute your attack on Islamic scripture. Your God is no different than Allah - indeed he is the same god Abraham worshipped, Yahweh, Jehovah and Allah are just different names from different languages. You differ only on which writings authored by men you choose to treat as your only source of evidence.

ecofox wrote:Are you ready to let go of all bias, and misconceptions to seek Truth with all of you heart?

Yes, I have spent most of my life improving my knowledge in order to get a more accurate, complete and useful knowledge of reality. As new evidence comes to light I have often revised my position. Until a few years ago I was very skeptical about global warming for example. Working in the coal mining and oil & gas industry as I have done for most of my career I would very much prefer it not to be true. Unfortunately the evidence continues to mount and the preponderence of evidence points to it being closer to the truth than the alternative. Somehow BHL's smug assurance that it isn't happening fails to give me any confidence.

If however you mean am I willing to abandon reason, evidence and the scientific method in favour of the mythology of bronze age goat herders, then the answer is no.

But you are changing the subject from Islamic terrorism.
December 26th, 2009, 10:46 pm
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Liv wrote:Large amounts of money sometimes work.

I expect that all really dedicated terrorists are "untouchables" when it comes to money. Especially the ones that are born into wealthy families in the first place.
December 28th, 2009, 8:07 am
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SouthernFriedInfidel wrote:It appears that Al Qaeda is still working on their goal of terrorizing America at all costs. Oddly, this attack that was attempted yesterday only had one fellow who got through security. This story doesn't mention the question of whether multiple attacks might have been attempted (as is Al Qaeda's wont), which I find interesting. Another failure of the media to ask the questions that ordinary people want answered...

The "media" has been failing us this entire decade and has only gotten worse....

Of course, there are a lot more questions to be discussed in the coming months. Like how are they going to upgrade security screenings as a result of this? This sap carried his explosives apparently packed around his junk. Will airport screenings become more intrusive as a result? NOT looking forward to getting that question answered...


The real question is what was he going to do with forty virgins when he gets to heaven with his "junk" blown off?



The whole thing needs to be re-thought. And I hope there are people in Washington who are courageous enough to state that fact to the right people.

hmmmm...good point, but as we have just recently witnessed, we need to bribe these so-called Senators and Congressmen, and then call it great legislation....

Curious though as to who you deem the "right people"?
December 28th, 2009, 9:41 am
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deepshade wrote:
The whole thing needs to be re-thought. And I hope there are people in Washington who are courageous enough to state that fact to the right people.

hmmmm...good point, but as we have just recently witnessed, we need to bribe these so-called Senators and Congressmen, and then call it great legislation....

The amount of money needed appears to be beyond the capacity of the American people to gather together. :cry:
Curious though as to who you deem the "right people"?

Policy makers. The folks who are actually responsible for the operations of the government.
December 28th, 2009, 9:58 am
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A Person wrote:Yes it's called religion. They know 'Absolute Truth' and act on it. They trust the "Word of God" and follow God's instructions to the letter.

Changing the mind of a religious zealot, convinced he has a direct line to God, isn't easy since they are not amenable to reason. If you try, they respond with long rants of scripture, screeds of misinformation and propaganda, all the while complaining about how persecuted they are.

Interesting news article on a Taliban teen indoctrination center found in Pakistan recently.

The Detroit attacker's family says they can't understand how a devout, kind student like this guy could be turned to "the dark side." I think this article points to some answers. All you need is personal doubt, a little depression, and a fanatic can find a wedge to drive between a normal kid and his peaceful morals. What strikes me about this story is that it really doesn't require the Muslim religion to work. ANY religion can be used to twist someone in a weakened mental state into a religious killer. This has been demonstrated all through history.

Sad. :cry:
January 6th, 2010, 7:53 am
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It's the same methods the $cientologists and other cults have used successfully for years. Deception, exclusion, fear, intimidation, love bombing, relationship control, information filtering, privileged hierarchy and busy work.
January 6th, 2010, 10:42 am
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A Person wrote:It's the same methods the $cientologists and other cults have used successfully for years. Deception, exclusion, fear, intimidation, love bombing, relationship control, information filtering, privileged hierarchy and busy work.

These methods seem rather to be the sort of thing that would have been around for a very long time. Probably for thousands of years. Certainly, there have been fanatics willing to give 100% deadly effort in service of their gods.
January 6th, 2010, 2:43 pm
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SouthernFriedInfidel wrote: ANY religion can be used to twist someone in a weakened mental state into a religious killer. This has been demonstrated all through history.


Any man made religion.

I hope you are able to make the distinction, or care to.
January 6th, 2010, 3:01 pm
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